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  #41  
Old Sep 24th, 2013, 07:28 AM
jishi jishi is offline
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Originally Posted by ratty View Post
Play:3s use the regular 2.4GHz SonosNet mesh when paired. The 5GHz is for Playbar to talk to its satellites, an operation master-minded by Playbar using a conventional hub/spoke architecture.
I think it would have made sense that the "slave" node of a stereo pair is directly associated with it's master (or atleast lowest path cost, and not through the STP root), since it's only function would be to stream from the master. Can't help thinking that it's a design flaw in that case. Maybe that's not possible if it relies solely on STP to discover network paths though.

I'm not sure how power lines affect wireless, but I would consider the proximity to a big central power line point to be a potential issue.
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  #42  
Old Sep 24th, 2013, 09:31 AM
ratty ratty is offline
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I think it would have made sense that the "slave" node of a stereo pair is directly associated with it's master (or atleast lowest path cost, and not through the STP root), since it's only function would be to stream from the master. Can't help thinking that it's a design flaw in that case. Maybe that's not possible if it relies solely on STP to discover network paths though.
The current scheme can indeed result in two wireless 'leaves' communicating via a distant 'trunk'. Even with an interconnecting cable, if the wireless root cost difference between them is less than 10 they'll ignore it.

To use local 5GHz between the pair would require the Play:3 to operate in simultaneous dual-band mode (2.4GHz being necessary to talk to the mesh) and Playbar is the only unit which can currently do this. Once it's bonded as a satellite a Play:3 becomes 5GHz-only. Moreover both channels would need to operate in dual-band mode: the right (slave) unit could be much better placed to pull the stream from the mesh than the left (master). Play:5 of course is stuck with 2.4GHz.

Since Sonos uses a modified form of STP maybe they could artificially reduce the wireless path cost between a bonded pair. This could potentially have the same effect on the local topology as stringing a cable between them. In fact Playbar satellites see a path cost as low as 50 instead of the 2.4GHz minimum of 150. Depressing the path cost between the pair could however have unwanted side-effects on the topology where more distant nodes rely on either of the pair for their active connection.
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  #43  
Old Sep 24th, 2013, 10:02 AM
NoBoB NoBoB is offline
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I'll catch and send later today. Thanks.
Be sure to followup with an email or phone contact referencing the diagnostic number to generate an actual support action. Diagnostics that appear without reference are eventually discarded.
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  #44  
Old Sep 24th, 2013, 10:13 AM
ratty ratty is offline
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In fact go to https://sonos.custhelp.com/app/ask to file a formally ticketed support request.
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  #45  
Old Sep 25th, 2013, 06:57 AM
mrjofus1959 mrjofus1959 is offline
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I submitted my issue via the "ask" system yesterday, so now I guess I wait for a response. I noticed it can sometimes take days for a response looking at other postings original time of submission versus the first Sonos response so I'll be patient!

One more data point from a brief experiment last night... I separated the stereo pair out in the garage, and then selected the "right" speaker to create a new stereo pair. But instead of selecting the speaker that's physically on the left as the "left" speaker I used the speaker physically on the right as the "left". The network cable between the two speakers was disconnected. I started playing a Pandora radio stream and everything seemed fine for a bit. But then once again the right audio channel, which was being played through the speaker physically on the left, dropped out and stayed out. Reconnecting the network cable fixed the issue afters a few seconds.

So what' the point? There's nothing specifically wrong with either speaker's ability to play a music stream I believe. Either of them can play as a solo/non-stereo-pair device without any issues. But when I created a stereo pair the right audio channel drops out in wireless mode, regardless of which speaker is physically selected as the left audio channel. So I assume this is related to my noise floor/phyerr issues and some sort of inability on the system's part to maintain left-right communications through the bridge.

One more question - when two speakers are paired as stereo are the left and right audio channels split by the bridge and sent separately to each speaker? Or is the full stereo stream sent to both speakers and each speaker selects the appropriate L/R channel to play?
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  #46  
Old Sep 25th, 2013, 07:07 AM
ratty ratty is offline
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One more question - when two speakers are paired as stereo are the left and right audio channels split by the bridge and sent separately to each speaker? Or is the full stereo stream sent to both speakers and each speaker selects the appropriate L/R channel to play?
The latter. The Bridge is just a .... Bridge. It forwards traffic at the link layer (i.e. below the IP network layer) so it has no idea what it's sending to and fro.

Speaking of the Bridge, one of the interesting logs may be the Bridge's dmesg. Whilst we wait for a response from Sonos Support, have a look in the 'dmesg' item of the Bridge's section in http://x.x.x.x:1400/support/review and see whether it contains a lot of "TX jammed" messages.
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  #47  
Old Sep 25th, 2013, 07:28 AM
mrjofus1959 mrjofus1959 is offline
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Originally Posted by ratty View Post
The latter. The Bridge is just a .... Bridge. It forwards traffic at the link layer (i.e. below the IP network layer) so it has no idea what it's sending to and fro.

Speaking of the Bridge, one of the interesting logs may be the Bridge's dmesg. Whilst we wait for a response from Sonos Support, have a look in the 'dmesg' item of the Bridge's section in http://x.x.x.x:1400/support/review and see whether it contains a lot of "TX jammed" messages.
Thanks Ratty, that makes sense.

I'll look at the bridge dmesg file when I get home from work this evening.
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  #48  
Old Sep 26th, 2013, 03:10 AM
jishi jishi is offline
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Originally Posted by mrjofus1959 View Post
So what' the point? There's nothing specifically wrong with either speaker's ability to play a music stream I believe. Either of them can play as a solo/non-stereo-pair device without any issues. But when I created a stereo pair the right audio channel drops out in wireless mode, regardless of which speaker is physically selected as the left audio channel. So I assume this is related to my noise floor/phyerr issues and some sort of inability on the system's part to maintain left-right communications through the bridge.
The setup works the way that the "left" player is always the coordinator, and the right player "streams" from the left player. IT doesn't surprise me that you experience this, since both player will find a network path which will have the "least" cost to the STP root. In the case of a stereo pair, this will force the right channel player to traverse multiple wireless links (right player -> bridge -> left player), since it doesn't care about what the target is.

With that in mind, your stereo pair might work if your left player was promoted as STP root, but that would however force your other players to go through your wireless left speaker which might not be what you want (I think it's almost always preferable to have the wired unit as STP root). If you only had that pair and a bridge, it would be a different matter.
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