iTunes/NAS/Sonos integration...

[bkswain]

Hi all,

I'm reluctantly starting to use iTunes more, but only for the free podcasts and now, Genius playlists. I don't use an iPod or use iTunes to manage my music.

I'm trying to determine the best way to integrate everything, please bear with me as I explain this. Here's how I do things now:

* All music and iTunes library files are on NAS
* If I download new music (say from Amazon), it goes to a local folder on my laptop. Then I copy those new files to the NAS music share. When the local laptop folder is large enough, I burn to DVD and then delete the local files. So the only complete music collection is on NAS.

The issue I ran into with this is, when I add music to the NAS music share, iTunes doesn't update the library automatically. For that matter, I don't know if there is a way to force a re-scan of the library in iTunes, similar to the way Sonos updates can be done. I know there is some kind of "Automatically add to iTunes library" watched folder, but I'm fuzzy on how that works. If I copy files to that folder, will they automatically copy to my NAS? Will the local laptop files be deleted after (ie, before I have a chance to burn a DVD)?

Also, regarding the Genius playlists, I've been exporting to M3U into a folder where Sonos can see them. I gather from some other threads that maybe this step isn't necessary?

I'd be happy not to use iTunes at all, but I have to admit it has some features that I just haven't been able to find anywhere else.

Thanks!

[steelrat]

Yes.... there's an application called Itunes folder watch.... I've been using it to do exactly that. I add files to the share on the nas....

Then with itunes open, and running itunes folder watch, it will scan directories that have the music. If it's not in itunes it adds. There's also an option to go look for in itunes, but not on HD....

Works great. Will also create a playlist for what it just added, so I've been renaming them by date, so you can track what's getting added when......

[bkswain]

steelrat,

Thanks. I did find iTunes Folder Watch in my searches about how to deal with this. There are a couple other similar programs out there that folks have made also.

Trying them all out. The problem so far seems to be that, since my Library XML file is also stored on the NAS, it takes forever to update it. At least, I assume that's why it's so slow - I am on wireless also.

[steelrat]

Depending on your speed of wireless, that could make a difference....

I was running mine wired.... I've also found that depending on how many files it needs to update. That said, it's normally not too annoying. Plus on the initial update, you'll be putting a lot more in the database. So the next time.....

Just remember if you are using multiple applications, I'd put the itunes xml and other stuff in a safe place before and after, just to have them around.

[theguelahpapyrus]

Solution:

1. Go to preferences in iTunes and set your default music folder to a folder on the NAS. Check the box for allowing iTunes to keep your media folder organized.

2. Cut and paste all new music files to the "automatically add to iTunes" folder, a folder which will be automatically created once you complete step 1.

3. Set the default sonos library to the new music folder you created in step 1.

4. Every time you add new music to iTunes, open sonos music library settings and click "update music index now".

Hope this helps.

[p_guenther]

Hi all,

I have had difficulties integrating the three as well, I thought I would share my experience.

1) transferred itunes library from my laptop to the NAS drive: search for HT1364 on the apple support page for the detailed article

This system works well but it didn't bring over the itunes data files (.itl/.xml files which hold the playlist data). Without these files Sonos can import your music but not your playlists.

2) I copied and pasted the data files to the same location in the NAS (be careful to keep the same file structure as itunes had on your computer.

3) I opened itunes in safe mode (holding shift) and directed it to open the library file from the NAS

4) I directed sonos to this file and update it regularly to ensure content is up to date (there is no automatic update from what I can tell)

[p_guenther]

I should note that itunes did have some difficulty running from the NAS drive, which still isn't running smoothly.


-itunes is slower than when it was running on my laptop, I believe this has to do with the management of the data files, not the streaming of songs
-itunes had problems opening, stating that the library (.itl) was open elsewhere. I believe this may have something to do with Sonos reading the library file. I had to import a backed up library file that I made the week earlier.

Does anyone know if Sonos can manage without the original itunes data files?

Does anyone have any suggestions on how to run it smoother??

Thanks!

[jgatie]

Originally Posted by p_guenther

4) I directed sonos to this file and update it regularly to ensure content is up to date (there is no automatic update from what I can tell)

Sonos can do a scheduled index update every day at the same time. You can set it up in the Advanced settings under Manage Music Library.

[Buegie]

Originally Posted by p_guenther

I should note that itunes did have some difficulty running from the NAS drive, which still isn't running smoothly.

-itunes is slower than when it was running on my laptop, I believe this has to do with the management of the data files, not the streaming of songs

That is normal. iTunes (or any program) is quickest when reading off an internal drive.

A USB direct-connected External Hard Drive (ExHD) would be slightly slower.

A network-wired (Cat5/6) NAS would be slower still.

A wireless connected NAS will be even slower.

On my Laptop, the Read/Write (R/W) speeds are almost immediate. On an ExHD directly connected to my Laptop, I get between 10-22MB per second (that's megabytes - not megabits). A wired connection to my NAS sees around ~4MB/sec. A wireless network NAS connection is ~2MB/sec or less.

If you have a large music collection (therefore a large iTunes Library file) and/or are manipulating Lossless music files, a wireless NAS connection will cause painful headaches. Find a way to wire your laptop to the network when using iTunes.

Originally Posted by p_guenther

-itunes had problems opening, stating that the library (.itl) was open elsewhere.

That could be almost anything. Up to and including poor PC hygiene. Reboot your PC and make sure you know where your iTunes Library files are. Also make & keep very current backup files of both the .ITL and .XML iTunes Library files.

Originally Posted by p_guenther

I believe this may have something to do with Sonos reading the library file.

Sonos only reads the .XML file from iTunes (never the .ITL file). iTunes does not read the .XML file unless you have corrupted the .ITL file.

iTunes creates the .XML file for other programs to use. iTunes will continuously update the .XMLfile when changes are made to your Library. Once the write process is done, Sonos can access the .XMLfile without the need to close iTunes (I have repeatedly verified this using my system - YMMV, however).

Originally Posted by p_guenther

I had to import a backed up library file that I made the week earlier.

A week old backup file may require significant re-work depending on how much went on during that week. The general model is to backup your files as soon as you do not want to re-do the new work up to that date. Could be 10 minutes, could be 10 days of time. It's your effort that goes to waste. How valuable is your time?

Originally Posted by p_guenther

Does anyone know if Sonos can manage without the original itunes data files?

Sonos does not need iTunes at all. It will read the music files and metadata directly.

If, however, you want to incorporate the iTunes Playlists within Sonos, then make sure that Sonos can see the .XML file from iTunes and it is in the "proper" location for referencing the music files.

Originally Posted by p_guenther

Does anyone have any suggestions on how to run it smoother??

That's a wide-ranging question. The general answer is to better understand iTunes operation when moved off it's 'default' location and how Sonos uses the files.

It's a much bigger discussion that requires more specific questions from you. I have iTunes for my NAS Lossless files, but I do not need to actually run the iTunes program very often. Only when changing/adding music files.

The iTunes/Sonos/NAS combination works as well as anything else. One jyst needs to know the ins-and-outs of the various components.

Best of Luck

[p_guenther]

Thanks Buegie,
it sounds like you are a good resource for this topic

So seeing as a wireless NAS and iTunes data files are a slow match, what do you suggest?

Could I keep the data files on my computer, the music library on the NAS and regularily copy over the xml file to the NAS to ensure the playlists are up to date??

How else could I get sonos to read my xml file while keeping my iTunes running as smoothly as possible??

Thanks in advance for your assistance, very appreciated to get advice from someone who understands these systems well!